watervole: (Default)
Judith Proctor ([personal profile] watervole) wrote2009-01-17 01:19 pm
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Frustrating Scrabble

I'm having one of the most frustrating Scrabble games of my life.

Owing to some bug in Scrabble Worldwide, instead of a game with [livejournal.com profile] megamole , it set me up with someone else.  As the other person seemed quite happy to play, I decided to continue with the game.

She's an absolutely terrible player (14% wins in 157 games), though I realised she was bad from her opening move which wasted a number of good tiles for hardly any score at all.

The laughable thing about it is that her playing style (all two and three letter words, spread out along the double word scores) is actually making it quite difficult to beat her (that and a lucky play that gave her a two letter word with Z in a good position that netted her 60 points).  There's simply nowhere to play long words.  I've already had to discard one bingo as there was nowhere to place it.

I guess it's good for me in a way. For once, I'm actually having to think hard about how to create hooks and bingo lines, whereas normally, I just rely on them appearing in the normal course of the game.

It's actually possible that she'll beat me through sheer grinding board-lock. (I'm not the world's best player, but I expect to win around 2/3 of my games - with a bit of help from Richard)

She's just blocked a 'I' that I'd set up so there would be something to cross through. I wouldn't mind so much if it had been a better use of the position.  She wasted her Q there for 11 points, when there was a free U not far from a double word score which she could surely have used to much better effect if she'd waited to collect whatever she needed.  (The U would still have blocked me, but at least I'd have felt it was doing something useful)

Anyway, enough moaning. I'd better try and set up a new bingo line.  I nearly did it this time, but I could only make six letter words from the tiles I had in hand.

You''re being aboyned!

[identity profile] darth-tigger.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 01:50 pm (UTC)(link)
From The Meaning Of Liff by John Lloyd & Douglas Adams:

ABOYNE (vb.)
To beat an expert at a game of skill by playing so appallingly that none of his clever tactics or strategies are of any use to him.
ext_15862: (LOL)

Re: You''re being aboyned!

[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 02:28 pm (UTC)(link)
LOL!

Still, I think we've got her this turn. I used my precious blank a few turns ago to create a hook word, and unless she plays in that spot (and there's others more tempting to her style of play) I should finally be able to play 'entente'. But she really is teaching me the need to set up my own hooks. I'll be a better player as a result, even if it irks the heck out of me right now.
drplokta: (Default)

[personal profile] drplokta 2009-01-17 01:53 pm (UTC)(link)
If she's playing in such a way as to make it difficult for you to beat her, in what sense is she a bad player? The objective of the game is surely to beat the other player, not to run up a high score.
ext_15862: (Default)

[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 02:33 pm (UTC)(link)
She's a bad player because she wastes her tiles. Most of her turns, I can see how she could have scored more using the tiles that she played. Ignoring the turn with the 'Z' her average score is around 10.

I'll be extremely surprised if I don't end up beating her, but I'm having to change tactics in order to do so (which is a good learning exercise for me).

The last 'bad' player I encountered, I asked if she'd like a few tips. She said 'yes', learnt very fast and is now giving me a really tough game - if that player beats me this time, I'll be pleased.

[identity profile] emmzzi.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 02:28 pm (UTC)(link)
I'm not sure 'not playing the way I like to' = "terrible player!" frustrating, I'll give you...
ext_15862: (Default)

[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 02:34 pm (UTC)(link)
I carefully defined her in terms of the game as a whole. Anyone who has lost 86% of over 150 games can safely be defined as terrible.

[identity profile] emmzzi.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 03:14 pm (UTC)(link)
I don't think we'll agree on this one as I think 'bad' is subjective. So, I can cope with 'I find her a bad player', or 'I find her a frustrating player'; but not 'she is (objectively) bad.' (or absolutely terrible.) as in, I think it, therefore it is.

There may be learning problems, dyslexia, a totally different motivation to you for playing the game which make her, in her mind, wonderful; and winning, having lots of long and interesting words, whatever, may not be her motivation!

But, I'll agree to differ! And I hope your next few moves with her enable you to get enjoyment out of the game.
ext_15862: (dice)

[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 04:36 pm (UTC)(link)
Let's say then, that I find her an unskilled player.

Now I've opened up the board, it's a whole new game. I'm 80 points in the lead and lots of space to play in.

Dyslexia isn't really an issue in Scrabble, you can use the ingame spellchecker to check a word is valid before you play it. There's an on-screen list of valid two-letter words to give you a hand.

I don't think she's stupid, some of her moves aren't bad at all. I suspect half her problem is that she puts down the first word that comes to mind without looking to see if there's a better one.

[identity profile] gaspodex.livejournal.com 2009-01-18 12:10 am (UTC)(link)
The problem with dyslexia and scrabble (aside from the fact i believe it's in the rules that you can't check words until after you have played them whatever the online version seems to think) is that dyslexia is not just bad spelling (in fact yes, scrabble can help bad spellers) - although thats a big part, the real issue is that i just can't see words from a jumble of letters - my mind (the diagnosed dyslexic part) just doesn't make the conection with the tiles on the rack, it certainly nothing to do with my vocab, its simply something my mind will not do - and i've tried.
ext_15862: (Default)

[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2009-01-18 09:27 am (UTC)(link)
The online version comes with two options. you can play what they call a 'challenge' game where you aren't allowed to check words before playing them, and 'regular' where you are allowed to keep on trying until you get a word spelt correctly.

I've no idea if my opponent is badly dyslexic, but if she is, I would have thought that she wouldn't be keen enough on Scrabble to have played over 160 games?

For mild dyslexics like my youngest son, there's a still a game to play even with poor spelling. Henry (and Richard) both play better tactics than I do, even though I have better word knowledge. Their ability to spot a way of playing a high scoring letter on a bonus square means they will often find a better move than I will - even though the Scrabble program will reject many incorrect spellings.
ext_15802: (Default)

[identity profile] megamole.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 05:39 pm (UTC)(link)
No, but playing so as not to score any points...
ext_15862: (And how has your day been?)

[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 07:01 pm (UTC)(link)
There's two exposed triple word scores. One should be staggeringly easy to play on. Instead, she did a move for nine points that opened up another triple word score. I'm a hundred points ahead now that I've opened up the board properly.

It's frustrating. First because it was hard to play well, now because there's no sense of competition.

[identity profile] esmeraldus-neo.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 05:03 pm (UTC)(link)
Dear lord, you strategize. You would beat me sooo badly.

I'm not as bad as your opponent, but I'm very, very bad. Terrible. God-awful, even, for someone who does what I do for a living.
ext_15862: (Default)

[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 05:08 pm (UTC)(link)
LOL! Fancy a game?

I was a terrible player until a friend gave me a simple tip: "hang onto the letters RETAINS" If you do this, you can pretty well guarantee a seven-letter word at some point in the game, maybe two.

I'd never had a single bingo until I tried this, now I find it an odd game where I don't get at least one.

[identity profile] rockwell-666.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 10:56 pm (UTC)(link)
Err, ok, so what is a "bingo"?
ext_15862: (Default)

[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2009-01-18 09:20 am (UTC)(link)
A 'bingo' is a seven letter word using up all of your tiles, carries a 50 point bonus.

[identity profile] rockwell-666.livejournal.com 2009-01-18 07:15 pm (UTC)(link)
Duh! Yes, of course, I should have seen that from the context... :(

Although isn't it usually knowing all those obscure two-letter words that is the essence of winning Scrabble because you can effectively turn one word into several?
ext_15862: (Default)

[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2009-01-18 07:46 pm (UTC)(link)
The two letter words provide good hooks for bingos, but the real points are in the bingos.

You can easily get 20 points with a lot of two or three letter words, but a bingo will normally net you at least 60 and 70 is pretty common as you can often make one cross a double-word score.
ext_15802: (scrablz)

[identity profile] megamole.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 05:40 pm (UTC)(link)
Fancy a game? ;-)

[identity profile] philbradley.livejournal.com 2009-01-17 09:49 pm (UTC)(link)
I see what you mean, what you say, and accept your definitions. Of course, you're right to say she's a terrible player in that respect of losing a lot of games.

However, your post cuts right to the heart of games playing. Perhaps she's having a great time, really trying, cheering to herself when she gets a few points and so on. While that may make her a bad player in one sense, on the other hand, if she's getting a lot out of the game, and enjoying it then I'd say that she's actually a good player. From what you've said, the major point that you have in playing is to win; that comes out in everything you've written here. Consequently you're getting irritated, confused and annoyed and not really enjoying yourself; it could be argued in that sense that you're not a good player.

I think the problem here is a total conflict in attitudes, approach and style. I think if I'd been you I'd have resigned ages ago. But then I don't play to win; winning is hardly even a consideration when I play - any game.
ext_15862: (dice)

[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2009-01-18 09:18 am (UTC)(link)
It depends on the type of game and who I'm playing. Some games I play almost entirely for the social aspect. If I'm playing a friend, then the social aspect will be more to the fore.

However, in this game there is no social aspect at all. I've sent her a few messages trying to open a conversation, but she isn't interested.

When you're playing an online game against a total stranger with no conversation, then playing to win is really the only aspect left.

[identity profile] philbradley.livejournal.com 2009-01-18 10:15 am (UTC)(link)
But... if you're not enjoying it, why do it?
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[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2009-01-18 11:17 am (UTC)(link)
Because I'm getting so annoyed with her that winning is the only way of getting rid of the irritation...

And also because it's bad manners to drop out of a game.

[identity profile] alexmc.livejournal.com 2009-01-18 01:21 pm (UTC)(link)
Personally I think that preventing your opponents from winning is a satisfactory strategy iin most games
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[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2009-01-18 03:32 pm (UTC)(link)
As it happens, I'm now 100 points ahead and still finding it frustrating.

[identity profile] undyingking.livejournal.com 2009-01-19 09:51 am (UTC)(link)
Gosh, commenters don't seem to have been very sympathetic to your woes! FWIW I can see that it must be pretty frustrating playing someone like that. If it was me, I would probably get inattentively sucked into matching her game style.
ext_15862: (Default)

[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2009-01-19 10:30 am (UTC)(link)
I did get sucked into her style to start with. Then I went the opposite way and went overboard to break out onto the open board and score a bingo at any price. I'm now leading by 170 points.