watervole: (Eye of Horus)
Judith Proctor ([personal profile] watervole) wrote2006-10-07 10:11 pm
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Random thoughts on veils

This will be brief (as the tooth is aching), but I was listening to an interesting phone in on Radio 4 this afternoon which had a number of very intelligent contributions.

It seems to me that a Muslim woman's veil has very different meanings in different parts of the world.

There are parts of the world where it can, and is, used to subjugate women; but in Britain, some women wear it very much as a positive gesture - as an outward declaration of their faith. (I felt really sorry for one woman who had worn it until recently and had been forced to give it up as she could no longer bear the name-calling from people in the street) There are families where some daughters freely choose to wear it and some do not. There are women of Anglo-Saxon ethnic origin who choose to wear it after converting to Islam.

It actually seems to me that wearing the veil in many countries shows a lack of freedom/independence for women, but that in Britain (for some women at least), it is the wearing of it that demonstrates freedom and independence.

I don't like it - I find it alienating not to see someone's face - but I'm starting to understand why some women choose to wear it.

[identity profile] dev-iant.livejournal.com 2006-10-08 11:24 am (UTC)(link)
I think that people should abide by the customs and conventions of the country they are in. If I was in a muslim country, I would expect to abide by their expectations and I think that they should do so in this country.

Like you, I find veils alienating, but mostly I feel that they are symbols of repression - I find it difficult to understand why any person, given a free choice, would choose to wear one. Even if some women do genuinely chose to wear them, this still reinforces the pressure on those who are given no choice.

You could argue that wearing a hoodie is a demonstration of freedom and independence, but that doesn't mean that people should be allowed to wear them (at least to cover up their faces.)
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[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2006-10-08 12:42 pm (UTC)(link)

I think that people should abide by the customs and conventions of the country they are in. If I was in a muslim country, I would expect to abide by their expectations and I think that they should do so in this country.


How many female tourists wear head coverings, let alone a veil, when in a Muslim country? (they certainly did not when I was in Istanbul)


I think that in this country, there is strong pressure NOT to wear a veil, thus, those who do so are probably doing it more to make a visible statement of faith than anything else.

[identity profile] dev-iant.livejournal.com 2006-10-08 04:33 pm (UTC)(link)
Head coverings are reasonable - I must say that I don't think that wearing a veil is a reasonable expectation (Western eyes, I suppose).

I disagree on the pressure - while there is pressure from society as a whole not to wear a veil, there can be much stronger pressure from the men in the family to wear a veil, especially if the women have little contact with non-Muslims.

ext_50193: (Calvin)

[identity profile] hawkeye7.livejournal.com 2006-10-08 08:18 pm (UTC)(link)
How many female tourists wear head coverings, let alone a veil, when in a Muslim country? (they certainly did not when I was in Istanbul)

By law, you have to in some countries but few of the locals wear head covering, much less a veil in Western Turkey so it isn't a custom or convention there.

Being a good tourist, I have always respected the conventions in your country, such as removing headgear in churches.
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[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2006-10-08 09:12 pm (UTC)(link)
When I was in Istanbul, as soon as you got out of the city centre, virtually all the women wore headscarves. Indeed, I found that if I wore one myself, it greatly reduced the number of beggers, etc. asking for cash - presumably they thought I was local.
ext_50193: (Calvin)

[identity profile] hawkeye7.livejournal.com 2006-10-09 09:11 am (UTC)(link)
When I was a boy, it was common for women in the UK to wear head scarves. Is this still the case?
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[identity profile] watervole.livejournal.com 2006-10-09 09:30 am (UTC)(link)
No, it's very rare now.